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June 6, 2019
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As a Stock Trader with home office can I report my Capital Gains on line 8 Sch C along with my Home Office expenses , instead of Sch d ?

  • June 6, 2019
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Best answer by Coleen3

No. Capital Gains are income, not expense. If you meet all the qualifications below and you timely made the mark-to-market election, you can include gains on Form 4797 and expenses on Schedule C.

Traders

Special rules apply if you're a trader in securities, in the business of buying and selling securities for your own account. The law considers this to be a business, even though a trader doesn't maintain an inventory and doesn't have customers. To be engaged in business as a trader in securities, you must meet all of the following conditions:

  • You must seek to profit from daily market movements in the prices of securities and not from dividends, interest, or capital appreciation;
  • Your activity must be substantial; and
  • You must carry on the activity with continuity and regularity.

The following facts and circumstances should be considered in determining if your activity is a securities trading business:

  • Typical holding periods for securities bought and sold;
  • The frequency and dollar amount of your trades during the year;
  • The extent to which you pursue the activity to produce income for a livelihood; and
  • The amount of time you devote to the activity.

If the nature of your trading activities doesn't qualify as a business, you're considered an investor and not a trader. It doesn't matter whether you call yourself a trader or a day trader, you're an investor. A taxpayer may be a trader in some securities and may hold other securities for investment. The special rules for traders don't apply to those securities held for investment. A trader must keep detailed records to distinguish the securities held for investment from the securities in the trading business. The securities held for investment must be identified as such in the trader's records on the day he or she acquires them (for example, by holding them in a separate brokerage account).

The Mark-to-Market Election

Traders can choose to use the mark-to-market rules, investors can't. If a trader doesn't make a valid mark-to-market election under section 475(f), then he or she must treat the gains and losses from sales of securities as capital gains and losses and report the sales on Form 1040, Schedule D.pdf, Capital Gains and Losses and on Form 8949.pdf, Sales and Other Dispositions of Capital Assets, as appropriate. When reporting on Schedule D, both the limitations on capital losses and the wash sales rules continue to apply. However, if a trader makes a timely mark-to-market election, then he or she can treat the gains and losses from sales of securities as ordinary gains and losses (except for securities held for investment - see above) that must be reported on Part II of Form 4797.pdf, Sales of Business Property. Neither the limitations on capital losses nor the wash sale rules apply to traders using the mark-to-market method of accounting.

A trader must make the mark-to-market election by the original due date (not including extensions) of the tax return for the year prior to the year for which the election becomes effective. You can make the election by attaching a statement either to your income tax return if filed without an extension or to a request for an extension of time to file your return. The statement should include the following information:

  1. That you're making an election under section 475(f);
  2. The first tax year for which the election is effective; and
  3. The trade or business for which you're making the election

Traders report their business expenses on Form 1040, Schedule C.pdfProfit or Loss From Business (Sole Proprietorship). The Schedule A limitations on investment interest expense, which apply to investors, don't apply to interest paid or incurred in a trading business. Commissions and other costs of acquiring or disposing of securities aren't deductible but must be used to figure gain or loss upon disposition of the securities. See Topic No. 703Basis of Assets. Gains and losses from selling securities from being a trader aren't subject to self-employment tax.

4 replies

Coleen3Answer
Employee
June 6, 2019

No. Capital Gains are income, not expense. If you meet all the qualifications below and you timely made the mark-to-market election, you can include gains on Form 4797 and expenses on Schedule C.

Traders

Special rules apply if you're a trader in securities, in the business of buying and selling securities for your own account. The law considers this to be a business, even though a trader doesn't maintain an inventory and doesn't have customers. To be engaged in business as a trader in securities, you must meet all of the following conditions:

  • You must seek to profit from daily market movements in the prices of securities and not from dividends, interest, or capital appreciation;
  • Your activity must be substantial; and
  • You must carry on the activity with continuity and regularity.

The following facts and circumstances should be considered in determining if your activity is a securities trading business:

  • Typical holding periods for securities bought and sold;
  • The frequency and dollar amount of your trades during the year;
  • The extent to which you pursue the activity to produce income for a livelihood; and
  • The amount of time you devote to the activity.

If the nature of your trading activities doesn't qualify as a business, you're considered an investor and not a trader. It doesn't matter whether you call yourself a trader or a day trader, you're an investor. A taxpayer may be a trader in some securities and may hold other securities for investment. The special rules for traders don't apply to those securities held for investment. A trader must keep detailed records to distinguish the securities held for investment from the securities in the trading business. The securities held for investment must be identified as such in the trader's records on the day he or she acquires them (for example, by holding them in a separate brokerage account).

The Mark-to-Market Election

Traders can choose to use the mark-to-market rules, investors can't. If a trader doesn't make a valid mark-to-market election under section 475(f), then he or she must treat the gains and losses from sales of securities as capital gains and losses and report the sales on Form 1040, Schedule D.pdf, Capital Gains and Losses and on Form 8949.pdf, Sales and Other Dispositions of Capital Assets, as appropriate. When reporting on Schedule D, both the limitations on capital losses and the wash sales rules continue to apply. However, if a trader makes a timely mark-to-market election, then he or she can treat the gains and losses from sales of securities as ordinary gains and losses (except for securities held for investment - see above) that must be reported on Part II of Form 4797.pdf, Sales of Business Property. Neither the limitations on capital losses nor the wash sale rules apply to traders using the mark-to-market method of accounting.

A trader must make the mark-to-market election by the original due date (not including extensions) of the tax return for the year prior to the year for which the election becomes effective. You can make the election by attaching a statement either to your income tax return if filed without an extension or to a request for an extension of time to file your return. The statement should include the following information:

  1. That you're making an election under section 475(f);
  2. The first tax year for which the election is effective; and
  3. The trade or business for which you're making the election

Traders report their business expenses on Form 1040, Schedule C.pdfProfit or Loss From Business (Sole Proprietorship). The Schedule A limitations on investment interest expense, which apply to investors, don't apply to interest paid or incurred in a trading business. Commissions and other costs of acquiring or disposing of securities aren't deductible but must be used to figure gain or loss upon disposition of the securities. See Topic No. 703Basis of Assets. Gains and losses from selling securities from being a trader aren't subject to self-employment tax.

Employee
June 6, 2019
How else can I help you?
February 5, 2021

It seems that no one really answered the question.  If a day trader,  shows expenses on Sch C and income on either Sch D or 4797 (if making the mark to market election, then business use of home will never be allowed unless there is a way to move those expenses directly to the Sch C instead of using the 8829. 

WendyN2
February 8, 2021

Yes, you can accomplish this, and below is a link to some very valuable information for your unique self-employed status and related forms of income/expense. This is no easy task as it is relatively new and hence why I am sending you to the Journal of Accountancy link as the information is up to date as of late Fall, 2020.

 

Day Trading And Self Employment - J of A

February 8, 2021

HI,  Thanks for the link.  I've already read the article.  If you, as a trader, make the mark-to-market election, you claim income from trades on the 4797, there is no wash sale allowance, there are deemed sales as of 12/31 of ea. yr and expenses on the Sch C.  If no mark-to-market election, then trades on Sch D, limited to $3000 total loss/yr and expenses on Sch C.  We're still back to the same question.  No Sch C income. 

April 13, 2021

I’ve read every article out there, there is no blueprint for how to actually get the “meatiest” part of the home office deduction!   No Sch. C income, no square footage deduction - period!  The utmost expert in this area, GreenTrader, hints at a they’re advising clients but wisely didn’t provide the step by step guidance on HOW to move “some” income over to Sch C (enough to balance the expense).  That might both reduce a red-flag (a Sch C with no income) and allow for the square footage deductions.  

 

Sounds to me like the  IRS never “fixed” this catch-22 and traders with TTS will have to live with this giant red-flag and be forced to make declarations of WHY it’s not really red.  Why is that OUR JOB????   Do your job !!!!!!

April 13, 2021

Hi,

I want to thank everyone who has responded.  Here is what I did and feel very comfortable.  

 

Until a trader requests the mark to market election, which they may never decide to do, all of their trades ultimately end up on the Sch D, the wash sale rules apply and they are limited to the $3000/yr loss.  

 

The expenses they may have like subscriptions. software, hardware, etc go on a Sch C.  Securities traders are not subject to SE tax on net income and they may qualify for OIH deduction despite not having net income on the Sch C.

 

On Part II of the 8829, line 8 calculation smart worksheet, line C, is where you will put the net profits, if any, from Sch D so the OIH deduction will be allowed.  I didn't see this at first as I have a bad habit of skipping over the worksheets. 

 

I hope this helps! 

April 9, 2023

Turbotax is disallowing my home office deduction because my expenses are shown on SCH C and as expenses are a negative number.  I am profitable but this profit is shown on form 9747 which turbotax is not recognizing to allow a home office deduction.  Is there anyway I can get turbotax to recognize my bussiness had a profit and allow me the home office deduction?  I am an active MTM trader of securities approver with the IRS already.  Thank you for any help.

April 9, 2023

I use Proseries, and on the 8829 line 8 calculation Smart Worksheet, there is a line that asks "calculated gain from business use of this home on Sch D or Form 4797".  That is where you will put the positive 4797 amount.

June 30, 2023

Thanks for your help!