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January 18, 2020
Question

Handling various 529 distributions to get to AOTC in TTax

  • January 18, 2020
  • 3 replies
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I'm not sure how to handle in TurboTax reporting my child's college expenses when there are multiple 529 sources and I'm trying to get AOTC credit.

 

I'll use round numbers for simplicity. 

  • My freshman child has qualified college expenses of $20,000. 
  • Grandparent A paid $5k toward them through 529 for child (distribution to school)
  • Grandparent B paid $12K toward them through another 529 for child (distribution to school)
  • I paid $1k for required laptop (took distribution from 529 I have for child). 
  • I paid another $2k for remainder of qualified expenses (not from 529) and want to claim that $2k for AOTC.

Child does not have other income to report.  Since Grandparent 1099-Q's go to child, I'm confused as to how to report it in TurboTax Deluxe. 

 

TTax currently claiming $2500 for AOTC when I know it should be $2000 - I'm identifying child's expenses of $20K vs. just the $1k 529 distribution I took so it's taking full $2500.  I didn't think I should/could enter the 1099Q's from grandparent 529s that are in child's name....but how else to reduce qualified expenses properly so I end up with $2,000 AOTC?

 

What steps to take in TTax?  Enter child's 1099-Qs from grandparent distributions?  Reduce numbers from 1099-T of qualified expenses?  Or something else?

3 replies

SusanY1
January 20, 2020

Before I give you an answer to this I want to clarify the amounts that you are including in the qualifying expenses of $20,000.  

 

The IRS has one definition of qualifying expense for the credit and another for distributions from the 529 plans. 

 

Does the $20,000 represent tuition and required fees only?  Or does it include other items such as room, board, activity fees, books, supplies, or any other expenses not required for attendance?  

 

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TaxGPVAAuthor
January 21, 2020

Susan - the breakdown of expenses are:

- $12,000 for tuition and required fees

- $6,000 for room and board

- $1,500 for required laptop

- $500 for books and supplies

 

NCPerson: I haven't received the 1099-T yet but expect the answer to that question (and what I'm tentatively entering until I receive it later this month) is $12,000 in box 1 and $0 in box 5 (no scholarships/grants).

 

I am aware of how the account owner, beneficiary and recipient rules work so am following that.

 

What I have found since posting this question is that the TTax interview seems to allow/expect me to enter all of the various 1099-Qs as it asks me who the recipient is and allows me to enter my child as the recipient on 3 of the 4 1099-Qs I'm expecting.  I'm not sure how to square that - entering all 1099 Q's during the interview, noting that 3 of 4 have my child as recipient, vs. the instruction that my child must file a separate return for the expenses and 1099 Q's even though my child is a dependent and has no other income.

 

Thanks and let me know if other clarifications are needed.  

January 22, 2020

@TaxGPVA - the reason TT asks for all the 1099-Qs to be enter and then all the questions is it decides based on those answers which 1099-Qs to entertain and which ones to dismiss as the average person wouldn't know what to do. So rather than explain all the rules to the average person, TT just asks you key them all in and then it decides which ones to use and which ones to dismiss - there is less risk of error that way. In fact, as detailed below, TT needed the grandfather's 1099-Q to be part of the equation because too much was distributed in total from the 529 plans (small, but see below)

 

The  "maximizer" in TT it is going to use AOC at $2500 - because $2500 of credits are more valuable than $2500 of deductions.   You are better off with the $2500 of AOC credits!  That will drive a $1,000 credit on line 18c of the form 1040.  if you "insist" that AOC only use $2000, your credit will only be $800 and you will not get back the other $200 any other way. 

 

That leaves $17,500 in college expenses to deal with.  Assume $2,500 of the tuition is covered by the AOC credit. 

 

The three 1099-Q disbursements are $18,000.... and all the remaining expenses are qualified expenses by the 529 plan.  This mean that $500 more than is required was disbursed.  That also means a small part of the Box 2 earnings on YOUR 1099-Q are subject to tax and you will see that on line 8 of Schedule 1.   That is because it wasn't needed to cover the expenses- you can't double dip and have both the 529 disbursements and the AOC credit cover the same dollar of college expenses.  The penalty for attempting to "double dip" is that part of the Box 2 earnings are taxable.  (the Box 3 cost basis was all after tax to begin with so there is no impact)

 

The $2000 that you came out of pocket for has no real bearing on the situation! 

 

I was able to create a dummy tax return in TT to confirm this result.

 

ps, because your child has no other income, there is no further reporting requirement of the 1099-Q's on his tax return because he is not required to file! 

 

hope that makes sense! 

January 20, 2020

beyond the question @SusanY1 asked, what is in Box 1 and Box 5 of the 1098-T? any numbers in any other boxes? if so, what are they? 

 

to simply your question, and awaiting @SusanY1 response, the 1099-Q are reported on the tax return of the person whose social security number is on the form, not who owns the 529 plan.  So you should find that you child's ss# should be on the forms via the grandparents 529 plans since those payments went directly to the college.  If you child is required to file, these 1099-Q's should be filed on the students tax return! 

Hal_Al
Employee
January 20, 2020

First, and most important of all, you should claim $4000 of expenses for the AOTC!  This will result in you son reporting a small amount of the 529 distributions as taxable income.

 

Treat the $1000 distribution you took in you name as qualified (non taxable).  Treat the grandparents distributions as described below.

 

For 529 plans, there is an “owner” (usually the parent and sometimes a grandparent or other relative), and a “beneficiary” (usually the student dependent). The "recipient" of the distribution can be either the owner or the beneficiary depending on who the money was sent to. When the money goes directly from the Qualified Tuition Plan (QTP) to the school, the student is the "recipient". The distribution will be reported on IRS form 1099-Q. 
The 1099-Q gets reported on the recipient's return.** The recipient's name & SS# will be on the 1099-Q.
Even though the 1099-Q is going on the student's return, the 1098-T should go on the parent's return, so you can claim the education credit. You can do this because he is your dependent.

You can and should claim the tuition credit before claiming the 529 plan earnings exclusion. The educational expenses he claims for the 1099-Q should be reduced by the amount of educational expenses you claim for the credit.
But be aware, you can not double dip. You cannot count the same tuition money, for the tuition credit,  that gets him an exclusion from the taxability of the earnings (interest) on the 529 plan. Since the credit is more generous; use as much of the tuition as is needed for the credit and the rest for the interest exclusion. 

 

Total qualified expenses (including room & board) less amounts paid by scholarship less amounts used to claim the Tuition credit equals the amount you can use to claim the earnings exclusion on the 1099-Q. 
Example:
  $10,000 in educational expenses(including room & board)

   -$3000 paid by tax free scholarship

   -$4000 used to claim the American Opportunity credit

 =$3000 Can be used against the 1099-Q (usually on the student’s return)

 

Box 1 of the 1099-Q is $5000

Box 2 is $600

3000/5000=60% of the earnings are tax free

60%x600= $360

The student has $240 of taxable income (600-360)

 

**Alternatively; you can just not report the 1099-Q, at all, if your student-beneficiary has sufficient educational expenses, including room & board (even if he lives at home) to cover the distribution. You would still have to do the math to see if there were enough expenses left over for you to claim the tuition credit. Again, you cannot double dip!  When the box 1 amount on form 1099-Q is fully covered by expenses, TurboTax will enter nothing about the 1099-Q on the actual tax forms. But, it will prepare a 1099-Q worksheet for your records, in case of an IRS inquiry.  I

January 21, 2020

@Hal_Al - while I totally agree with your example, have you run it through TT?  I tried it just to test out that TT handles it properly and TT continues to think the $600 of earning is subject to regular tax (it properly does not create the 10% penalty)

 

while I see your comment that you can not just report it, that moves the control from TT to the Taxpayer and THAT is what causes variation and inaccuracies in reporting.  You'd think TT would just request input of the 1098-T and the 1099-Q, ask about the non-qualified expenses (which it does) and be able to figure it out itself....or is there a bug???

 

any thoughts? 

Hal_Al
Employee
January 21, 2020

@NCPERSON1  - I have no tried it in the 2019 program, but it worked properly last year. 

I don't think there's a bug, but it's too complicated for the average user.